If you’re interests tend towards the more esoteric and unpopular areas of cosmology, nonhuman intelligence, UFOs, consciousness studies, and futurism, you could do much worse that taking your laptop down to the local coffee shop and wasting away the afternoon sipping on a mug and checking out the websites of Missouri-based author Mac Tonnies: mactonnies.com and Posthuman Blues.

In this interview, we chat with Mac about his unique “Cryptoterrestrial Hypothesis” of UFO contact, Mars anomalies, the future of humanity and whether Mac has ever had a UFO experience himself.

Mac is also the author of “After the Martian Apocalypse”- an “examination of extraterrestrial life on the red planet” – and “Illumed Black” – his science fiction collection.

Jason Lubyk: From what I understand your next book is going to be about what you call the “Cryptoterrestrial Hypothesis” of UFO contact. Can you explain to our readers what that is exactly, how it differs from the current theories in vogue now and what lead you to this conclusion?

Mac Tonnies: The Cryptoterrestrial Hypothesis (CTH) is an alternative to the Extraterrestrial Hypothesis — which, unfortunately, has become virtual dogma among “serious” ufologists. It’s both a thought experiment and a potential paradigm.

Essentially, I’m wondering if the ET mythos that accompanies the UFO phenomenon is memetic subterfuge emplaced by an indigenous humanoid intelligence. Jacques Vallee and John Keel have advanced similar ideas, but they’ve opted for a paranormal origin — a
“multiverse” and a “super-spectrum,” respectively. I’m not sure either is called for; we could instead be dealing with a flesh-and-blood species that’s eluded detection, which isn’t nearly as preposterous as many think.

If “cryptoterrestrials” are real, then it’s likely we outnumber them. I suspect they’re attempting to communicate with us without exposing themselves, both to ensure their own secrecy and to keep us from asking too many uncomfortable questions.

JL: I’m curious on what you read or experienced that lead you to consider this hypothesis? I lean towards the “multiverse” and “super-spectrum” approaches myself, although I guess they do not have to mutually exclusive. And if there are “others” sharing earth with us where would they be located, hiding?

MT: I was initially inspired by Vallee and Keel, but wondered if I could dispense with their ideas’ “paranormal” flavor and stick to something more earthly. Because often, as weird as occupant encounters are, they leave me with the impression that we’re dealing with beings that are fallible in a recognizably physical sense.

As for where they’re hiding, I find the numerous accounts of UFOs below and above lakes and oceans enormously suggestive. And I’m intrigued by the idea that these beings could literally pass for human (at least some of the time), diminishing the need to hide.

JL: Interesting that you mention that, as UFOs connected to bodies of water – from a psychoanalytic viewpoint – points the way somewhat to an archetypical interpretation of the UFO phenomenon. Are you familiar with Jung’s UFO theories – which were also adopted and promoted by psychedelic philosopher Terrence McKenna? Thoughts?

MT: Jung’s “Flying Saucers” is an incredibly important book. I’ve only recently been turned on to McKenna, whose thoughts on the human condition are nothing less than brilliant. McKenna strikes me as a sort of fusion of countercultural memes, from William Burroughs’ desire to “storm the reality studio” to Jacques Vallee’s observation that the Extraterrestrial Hypothesis simply isn’t weird enough to account for the UFO phenomenon

I personally think there’s a pronounced “psychic” component to the UFO enigma, but this doesn’t preclude a physical origin.

JL: Your previous book – “After the Martian Apocalypse: Extraterrestial Artifacts and the Case for Mars Exploration” – dealt with possible evidence of civilization on Mars. Any new compelling theories or discoveries in the field lately?

MT: No, but I think this will change soon. The Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter is taking pictures of unprecedented clarity and has the potential to resolve some lingering questions. There are several relatively unknown small-scale anomalies in the Cydonia region that I’d love to see in high resolution.

JL: Based upon what you have seen of the possible Mars monuments and architecture, have you ever thought of what the civilization would have been like? Any scenarios? And what do you hypothesize could have happened to it? Environmental destruction or something weirder?

MT: I get the impression we’re looking at the remains of a technologically and ecologically impoverished civilization. I think the “Martians,” wherever they came from, were attempting to prolong their existence in the wake of some sort of planetary cataclysm. There are other possibilities, of course, but that’s the one that continues to haunt me.

JL: Mac, I know you have an interest in transhumanism and also concerns about ecological catastrophe. On the surface they seem incompatible: liberation via a singularity omega point and biosphere collapse, although they could be reconciled by a Bill Joy-like scenario where transhuman ubermen lord over a non-upgraded humanity suffering in ecological terror zones. With these themes in mind, how do you see “us” in a 100 years time?

MT: For a while now I’ve been laboring under the assumption that we’re either going to achieve some sort of techno-utopia or else perish utterly – and now I realize this is a horrifically either/or way of thinking.

Bruce Sterling has remarked that “utopia” and “dystopia” will mean entirely different things to people depending on their respective socioeconomic status. One person’s paradise could very well be another’s living hell.

With that in mind, I think it’s becoming obvious that we’re in for a rough time, environmentally. Perhaps the most be can reasonably hope for is that our technology can mitigate against future damages so that we have some hope of building a more robust and sustainable world for ourselves a century or more from now. Maybe that’s wishful thinking.

JL: Have you ever seen a UFO or had a paranormal experience? If so, what happened?

MT: Unfortunately, I’ve never seen a UFO or made contact with aliens — although I have an incredibly rich dream life, which perhaps amounts to the same thing. I’ve experienced enough synchronicity to pretty much convince me that consciousness is more flexible than we typically admit — nothing I can prove to anyone else’s satisfaction, but you can’t have your cake and eat it too.